Thank God; someone finally shut him up. Boss I need to buy you a beer
Will Ole Miss drop the Confederate flag
- Thread starter demziah_01
- Start date
They typically shut up when presented with rational thought and an honest review of where gun violence is actually coming from.
How is that not logical? What's illogical is believing you can outlaw guns in America and the gun violence problem will disappear or greatly diminish. There are millions upon millions of guns out there with no way for the American government to confiscate them. The only ones they confiscate will be from law-abiding citizens...who are not the problem. It's not as if there is a "gun finding machine" than you can fly over each house and suck out the hidden, illegal guns.
The vast majority of the points in that post are inaccurate. The things that may technically be accurate, such as the crime rates in Flippen compared to Chicago, are flat out absurd comparisons to make. If you really want me to post factual information and statistics to show which of those things in his post are incorrect I will, but I just assumed that most people knew they were wrong.
I've not seen anyone say that guns should be outlawed in America so I don't know where that is coming from. Forget about the guns that are already out there. I'm talking about the ones that WILL be out there. There are an alarming number of guns being sold every day in this country. There are anywhere from 10-20 million guns sold in the United States every year. In 2013 the FBI reported running 21 million background checks on gun purchasers. 1.1% were denied.
People use the statistic that Arkansas is in the top 10 highest gun murder rate states in America per capita. For that I say that from 2000 to 2012 here are the statistics of homicides for the areas I listed compared to Little Rock. Again these areas have almost a 100% gun ownership rate
From 2000-2012
Mt Home- 2
Prescott- 4
Flippin - 0
Stuttgart- 9
Hamburg-3
Little Rock- 519
is this a state wide issue? No, it is not
Now let's look at some key metro areas in our nation over the same time period. most of which have some of the most strict gun laws on the books.
2000-2012
Miami- 876
Atlanta- 1469
Dallas- 2501
L.A. - 5256
Chicago- 6727
That's right folks. More people were killed in Los Angeles and Chicago (independently) from 2000-2012 than there were US soldiers who were killed in active duty during the Iraq war.
Is this a gun issue or a community and home based issue? I think it's pretty clear what the evidence tells us. We need to hammer criminals who use illegally obtained weapons with extremely tough sentences. Send the message that the killing spree is over and we won't tolerate it in our society. As well if more would be violent criminals, rapists, home invaders, and the like we're on the news shot dead the low lifes of our country just might think twice.
But hey, what do I know? I'm just some dumb redneck that loves to shoot shit and also just happens to live in a town full of guns with virtually no gun violence. Maybe we're the ones that have it figured out.... ya think?
From 2000-2012
Mt Home- 2
Prescott- 4
Flippin - 0
Stuttgart- 9
Hamburg-3
Little Rock- 519
is this a state wide issue? No, it is not
Now let's look at some key metro areas in our nation over the same time period. most of which have some of the most strict gun laws on the books.
2000-2012
Miami- 876
Atlanta- 1469
Dallas- 2501
L.A. - 5256
Chicago- 6727
That's right folks. More people were killed in Los Angeles and Chicago (independently) from 2000-2012 than there were US soldiers who were killed in active duty during the Iraq war.
Is this a gun issue or a community and home based issue? I think it's pretty clear what the evidence tells us. We need to hammer criminals who use illegally obtained weapons with extremely tough sentences. Send the message that the killing spree is over and we won't tolerate it in our society. As well if more would be violent criminals, rapists, home invaders, and the like we're on the news shot dead the low lifes of our country just might think twice.
But hey, what do I know? I'm just some dumb redneck that loves to shoot shit and also just happens to live in a town full of guns with virtually no gun violence. Maybe we're the ones that have it figured out.... ya think?
Last edited:
Remove Little Rock from the totals and see where we end up. Take New Orleans out of Louisiana's totals and see where they end up per capita. Memphis from Tennessee....If these graphs are accurate there seems to be a pretty strong correlation between per capita gun ownership and per capita gun deaths.
Arkansas is one of the highest in the nation in per capita gun deaths at over 15 per 100,000 people.
500+ people a year die in Chicago alone. The overwelmingly vast majority of our nation does not have a gun violence problem but damn near every one of our metro areas carry the murder flag for the rest of us.
Let's just get rid of all the cities in the country and we will be fine. Wipe out the majority of the population and virtually all of the minorities and things will be perfect.
Nope never said that but we do need to focus the effort to reduce murders where they actually take place and not board sweeping regulation that effects the vast majority of the nation with little or no gun homicides. Sorry that the facts of this issue don't align with your views. The staggering majority of gun crimes in our nation come from metro areas. Seems like we need MORE police in these areas MORE community interaction from local leaders MORE faith based efforts to support youth MORE visual scope of the public at large of what is actually happening there. Or we could do even less of those things and see just exactly how many people can get killed.
You wouldn't know a fact if it shot you in the foot. You might want to take a look at the largest city in the United States of America. Check those gun stats out. Check out California while you're at it. Comparing crime rates in tiny towns to those in major cities is foolish. If you want to bring some actual facts to this argument go ahead. The problem is that virtually none of them support your views. We all know what you are trying to say here. So why don't you come out and say it. Minorities in cities with guns are bad. White people in small towns with guns are good.
Are you trying to say minorities don't live in small towns?
Really? Do you honestly not know that the majority of minorities in this country live in urban areas. Whites make up about 78% of rural and small towns in this country as compared to 64% of the total population.
My question is this: if we stopped selling all guns today, what would America look like in 5...10...20 years from now?
HPHARRI 1994
I don't know why, but I can't shake the feeling as to why you remind me of the character Matt Douglas in McLintock. He was the guy who Katherine Gilhooley McLintock (Maureen O'Hara) called a hysterical fool.
Last edited:
Once again, posting in-line with the original theme of the Rebel Flag...
In the past few days on the Internet (and a little ITT) I have seen hundreds upon hundreds of people express the sentiment that the Rebel flag is a symbol of Southern heritage and not racism. Many (possibly not all) of those voices are also ones who assert that, if Islam truly is a religion of peace then moderate Muslims bear the burden (and the risk) of actively standing up to the extremists in their communities who commit acts of terrorism under the banner of Islam. I find a little irony in this, and I would ask these people: "What are you doing to stop the KKK from perpetuating racism and violence under the Stars and Bars?" If I saw some truckloads of good ole boys bustin' heads and confiscating Rebel flags at Klan rallies, I might start to believe that you actually believe what they are saying.
In the past few days on the Internet (and a little ITT) I have seen hundreds upon hundreds of people express the sentiment that the Rebel flag is a symbol of Southern heritage and not racism. Many (possibly not all) of those voices are also ones who assert that, if Islam truly is a religion of peace then moderate Muslims bear the burden (and the risk) of actively standing up to the extremists in their communities who commit acts of terrorism under the banner of Islam. I find a little irony in this, and I would ask these people: "What are you doing to stop the KKK from perpetuating racism and violence under the Stars and Bars?" If I saw some truckloads of good ole boys bustin' heads and confiscating Rebel flags at Klan rallies, I might start to believe that you actually believe what they are saying.
There is absolutely, without a doubt, 100% guarantee that gun violence numbers would decrease if that were to happen. I don't think anyone is saying to stop selling all guns today though. If we enacted stricter gun control laws nationwide we'd see results for sure.
hph .... you are 100% correct and I will admit it -- minorities are the problem .... however it's not ethnic or racial minorities, it's socialist-collectivist, urban-hip, nags who think a 90 point IQ and a sociology degree from GoatStink U make them smart.
You may be right...but with millions of guns already out there...I'm just not sure if that's correct. Are there any other nations with such a huge percentage of guns already in circulation that have done what you're talking about...with the results you are talking about?
The problem with your opinion is that there is an estimated 270-310 million guns in the US right now. How will stopping gun sales reduce that number and reduce gun violence with 100% certainty. Anyone that says things like (100% certainty) is certifiable.
Here is an interesting (and short) youtube video by TestTube News on gun control in Europe. Doesn't take a liberal or conservative slant...just presents some facts.
Nobody has said anything about stopping gun sales. I don't why people keep saying that. If you don't think that putting tougher restrictions on the 10-20 million gun purchases every year moving forward would help then so be it. I'm not sure how you could think that but it's fine if you do. I don't think that inaction is the way to go. This isn't an unpopular stance that I am taking. 90% of this country agrees that there should be tougher gun laws when it comes to the background checks and a few other things.
Back on the topic of the consecrate flag, I'm going to leave this little nugget here because it's 100% spot on.
http://www.thefader.com/2015/06/24/killer-mike-confederate-flag
KILLER MIKE: My opinion on the Confederate flag is quite simple and clear. I have no problem with Southerners who consider that a part of their heritage flying it privately in their homes or [wearing it] on their shirts or jackets. Even if that's your choice of vanity license plate, you pay a tax for your license plate in Georgia. So that's your tax, for your license plate. I have white friends who have the Confederate flag on their license plates and I have no issue with that, if they see that as a matter of heritage. But I do not think it should ever fly over a state, city, county building, or school, for the simple reason that it represents secession from the Union. It represented a part of the country trying to become a separate country from America. That side lost, and you do not fly the flags of losers over the winners' country. It's just that simple. There's no way around that.
http://www.thefader.com/2015/06/24/killer-mike-confederate-flag
KILLER MIKE: My opinion on the Confederate flag is quite simple and clear. I have no problem with Southerners who consider that a part of their heritage flying it privately in their homes or [wearing it] on their shirts or jackets. Even if that's your choice of vanity license plate, you pay a tax for your license plate in Georgia. So that's your tax, for your license plate. I have white friends who have the Confederate flag on their license plates and I have no issue with that, if they see that as a matter of heritage. But I do not think it should ever fly over a state, city, county building, or school, for the simple reason that it represents secession from the Union. It represented a part of the country trying to become a separate country from America. That side lost, and you do not fly the flags of losers over the winners' country. It's just that simple. There's no way around that.
Yeah...I don't see how anyone would have an issue with doing away with the flag on all government property. It doesn't belong there. If private citizens want to have a flag...then that's their right.
Stopped reading after this hysterical lie.
You responded to a post where Titan mentioned stopping gun sales.
Here it is....
Your response
But you still have never addressed the 100% true fact that hundreds of millions of guns already exist in this country. My point is that if you stopped selling all guns today, what about the 200-300 million guns that are already out there? And...what about the black market guns that would take the place of legal guns?
In other words...I totally understand that if someone didn't have a gun, it would make it harder for them to commit a gun crime. But I also don't think there is another nation on earth that has as many guns as America has, already. There's enough guns in circulation for almost every American to have one. What do you do about those?
And what did I say in response to that post?
I said yeah I'm sure it would help BUT I don't think anyone is saying to stop selling all guns today though.
I'm not ignoring the fact that those guns exist. This isn't a problem that is just going to be solved over night. You have to start somewhere and in my opinion that should be enacting tougher laws for those trying to purchase or sell guns. There isn't much that can be done about the existing guns. The tougher laws would make it more difficult to buy and sell used guns as well though.
Well perhaps you should've directed your question at Titan then.
You know exactly what I meant though. Nobody has suggested that we stop selling all guns as any sort of solution.
I would honestly need to see what their rates of gun violence was before a stricter law in each nation to make that decision. I would also want to know what societal effects there are that influence gun violence. Obviously, Switzerland is doing something right "societally" since about 50% of people there own guns, yet they have a small amount of gun violence.
Yeah I don't know what those numbers were prior to the laws. 50% does seem high but that is half of what we own. We are at pretty close to one gun for every person.
If we could keep guns out of the hands of mentally ill...or outright criminals...that would be great. Again...one of those things that is easier said than done. The Charleston and CT shooters both got their guns from their parents...who passed background checks. That's a hard issue to overcome.
And don't get me wrong...if guns were never invented, I would have been ok with that. Same thing goes with nuclear weapons. However...they're there...and I would actually like to be able to have those things in my possession just as protection from the bad guy on the other side (on the nukes...I'm just talking about my country having one to counterbalance).
Actually...they are saying 50% of residents own guns...but it doesn't tell how many. In the U.S...in the 1970's, about 50% of Americans own guns. Now...only about 32% of Americans own guns. So actually...a much larger percentage of Swiss own guns than Americans.
In 2014 there were 45.7 guns per 100 people in Switzerland as compared to 88.8 per 100 in the USA.
IMHO, the problem is the almost deification of guns by some Americans. "Gun worship" leads to irresponsibility. The mother in CT had a freakin' arsenal. She should not have allowed her disturbed son (or anyone else) access.
And, by all reports, the kid in SC was a proclaimed Nazi. What kind of parent gives a kid like that a gun?
Someone earlier mentioned civil liability for these people. I would say maybe criminal, too.
I mentioned the misiterpretaion of the Second Amendment in an earlier post. No responses.
"If guns were outlawed, only outlaws would have gins." Right. All those accidents and drunk fights and going postal when you find your wife in bed with another man would not happen.
Again, I would be happy to outlaw all guns, but I know that's not going to happen.
Titan is right that there's probably no way to deal with all the guns that are out there. But we have to start somehere.
The NRA and the gun worshipers need to quit being so paranoid and work with instead of against.
I think a clearance from a qualified psychologist should be required for anyone to purchase a handgun. (I know. Impractical because who pays for it. I will have to think on this and get back to you.)
Nobody with more than two DUI's should be allowed to own a handgun. (Does this come up as a flag on a background check. I don't know what qualifies someone for denial, but it isn't enough.)
More later.
And, by all reports, the kid in SC was a proclaimed Nazi. What kind of parent gives a kid like that a gun?
Someone earlier mentioned civil liability for these people. I would say maybe criminal, too.
I mentioned the misiterpretaion of the Second Amendment in an earlier post. No responses.
"If guns were outlawed, only outlaws would have gins." Right. All those accidents and drunk fights and going postal when you find your wife in bed with another man would not happen.
Again, I would be happy to outlaw all guns, but I know that's not going to happen.
Titan is right that there's probably no way to deal with all the guns that are out there. But we have to start somehere.
The NRA and the gun worshipers need to quit being so paranoid and work with instead of against.
I think a clearance from a qualified psychologist should be required for anyone to purchase a handgun. (I know. Impractical because who pays for it. I will have to think on this and get back to you.)
Nobody with more than two DUI's should be allowed to own a handgun. (Does this come up as a flag on a background check. I don't know what qualifies someone for denial, but it isn't enough.)
More later.
You need to show your work on this 90% number. I don't believe that number is accurate.
I would love to hear some of your ideas for SPECIFIC laws you would like to enact that would reduce gun violence. I'd also still like to know why you think semi-automatic rifles should be restricted more than other guns.
We're talking about two different things. Almost 50% of Swiss own guns...and only 32% of Americans own guns. Now, if you want to say that our 32% own a bunch of guns...fine. But I'm making a point that that half of Switzerland own guns and they don't have a gun violence issue. The question is why?
Now...if you want to make the statement that out of our 200-300 million guns...that many of them have been stolen or sold second-hand to criminals...fine. I would agree with that. But why is it different in Switzerland? They must being doing something right...though 50% own guns...and only 32% here (though I would imagine a much greater % here have guns...either through the black market or stolen guns).
Similar threads
